Interview: Emma Barnes talks about If We Knew How to We Would

Emma Barnes studied at the University of Canterbury and lives in Aro Valley, Te Whanganui-a-Tara, Wellington. Emma's poetry has been published in journals including Landfall, Turbine | Kapohau, Cordite and Best New Zealand Poems. They performed in Show Ponies in 2022 and 2023. Emma is the author of the poetry collection I Am in Bed with You and co-editor with Chris Tse of Out Here: An Anthology of Takatāpui and LGBTQIA+ Writers from Aotearoa. Emma talks to NZ Booklovers.

Tell us a little about If We Knew How to We Would.

It’s a three part book I spent about five years making. That timeframe feels a lot faster than my first book which was really about 25 years in the making and has work in it that spans 15 years. These ones are all much more tightly coupled into the times we’ve been in since 2020. I’ve said a couple of times now that the first section is horny, the second section is sad and the final section is weird. That’s the rough shape of it! 

What inspired you to write this collection of poetry?

I write quite regularly. Writing is a part of my life and just what tends to happen to me pretty much every week! After a few years of writing regularly, often there’s enough for a book. I assemble books. I don't really write them. But in terms of inspiration I guess the wider themes in the book I have been obsessed with are things like love and relationships, how to stay alive in a difficult world, climate change, bodies, gender, existence, aging, ancestors, the way covid has changed the world. Just a few little things!

What was your routine or process when writing this collection?

I worked an intense job from 2020-2023 and had some very serious life stuff going on. After work on Wednesdays and Thursdays I would often end up at the end of the bar at Golding’s in Te Whanganui a Tara and just write for a couple of hours. It’s a great environment for me because I’m not taking up too much space, there’s a lot of good people noise and activity, and I was generally very tired which helped me get into a good creative space very easily. When I felt like I had enough poems for a book I just went through and assessed each poem for its energy and developed a shape from that. It’s often hard for me to distinguish individual poems so writing down their various themes and energies was a helpful way to structure it. Then I just kept fooling around with it until I felt like it was enough! I did take on a bit too much early reader feedback at one point and forgot I was the author. But I remembered eventually!

If a soundtrack was made to accompany this book, name a song or two you would include. (optional)

Ooooh tricky! Probably Crush by Natte Visstick, RHYTHM and Yellow Claw. It was on the Babygirl soundtrack but don’t hold that against it. It’s a great track, especially for deadlifts. And Loud Bark by Mannequin Pussy. I saw Mannequin Pussy last year at San Fran and they played this song and seeing it live is even better.

If you had to choose your favourite poem from the collection, what would it be, and why?

I think I would choose The bed made of bodies. I wrote this poem in a yurt in Te Wairarapa during an absolutely massive storm that lead to lots of flooding and trouble when we eventually tried to get home. The poem picks up some of this watery influence from tears to the ocean. I think it just speaks to how much I want everyone to get the comfort they need and how hard that can be to achieve.

What did you enjoy the most about writing these poems?

I love writing poems full stop. It’s in my top five things to do in life alongside deadlifts etc. Some of these poems were tricky for me. They engage with some really open-ended questions where there are no good answers. That feeling of creatively grappling with big problems is probably what I like most about writing. And then there is the silliness and word play. I like jokes. Hopefully, people get my jokes. I think sometimes writing feels like being an alchemist, trying to turn a bunch of feelings into something golden.

What did you do to celebrate finishing this book?

We just had a lovely launch at 2/57 in Wellington with many thanks to Unity Books for snacks, wine and bookselling. Everyone wore a pink mask to match the book and as I’m not a fan of speeches I asked three lovely readers to pick poems from my book to read. I highly recommend getting others to read your poems aloud. It’s beautiful. Always Becominging, Chris Tse and Ruby Solly are all wonderful readers too. It was really lovely. Launches are a bit like big birthday parties or weddings though. All these people are there for you but you never really get to have a big chat with anyone!

What is the favourite book you have read so far this year and why?

I’ve read a lot of good books this year so it’s actually quite hard to pick. I’m going to go with Underland by Robert Macfarland. I just finished this yesterday and it’s so poetic and beautiful and filled with sadness and exploration of ourselves and the world around us. Special mentions also to Girlhood by Melissa Febos and No Straight Road Takes You There by Rebecca Solnit. I’m not good at selecting just one favourite and those two writers are some of my favourite writers.

What’s next on the agenda for you?

I’m not really sure! After a book there’s always a period of evolution where I try and write into new spaces. My writing has always evolved but books seem to make a very clear temporal marker and since submitting this book for editing at the start of this year I’ve been writing and figuring out where to next. I ventured into writing blog posts for a while, that was fun and felt like being in the 2000s again. I’ve been back on poems recently but I’m not sure they’re enough of a departure for me as yet. It’s very hard to say. I’m just filling the tank back up and following my nose. I’ve read over 50 books since January which is a large amount for me. I think it speaks a bit to how I’m in an exploration phase, figuring out what’s next.

Photo credit: Rebecca McMillan

Auckland University Press